Dan Rather Reports

Episode Number: 236

Episode Title: The Passion of His Politics--A Candid Conversation with James Carville

Description: Dan Rather and Democratic strategist James Carville discuss the state of politics-2008.

Transcript:

GOOD EVENING FROM NEW YORK WE'RE BROADCASTING FROM A BEAUTIFUL OLD THEATER IN WHAT IS KNOWN AS THE 92ND STREET Y. IT'S A FAMOUS VENUE FOR PUBLIC DISCUSSION IN NEW YORK CITY AND RECENTLY I WAS INVITED BY THE Y TO SIT DOWN IN THIS AUDITORIUM WITH ONE OF THE GREAT POLITICAL MINDS OF OUR TIME DEMOCRATIC PARTY STRATEGIST JAMES CARVILLE KNOWN AS THE RAGIN CAJUN CARVILLE FIRST CAME ON THE NATIONAL SCENE AS A POLITICAL CONSULTANT FOR BILL CLINTON HE WAS LATER A SENIOR ADVISOR IN THE WHITE HOUSE AND HAS BEEN INVOLVED IN INTERNATIONAL POLITICAL CONSULTING JAMES CARVILLE IS MANY THINGS, BUT SHY IS NOT ONE OF THEM ESPECIALLY ABOUT HIS POLITICS SO NOW A CONVERSATION WITH JAMES CARVILLE (APPLAUSE) THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR THAT WONDERFUL INTRODUCTION I KNOW JAMES SHARES IT AND THANK YOU AND THE AUDIENCE FOR THIS WARM RECEPTION LET'S GET RIGHT TO IT, LET'S TALK POLITICS WOW..(LAUGHS) I THOUGHT WE WERE GOING TO TALK ABOUT NEUROSURGERY JAMES LET'S TALK ABOUT AL GORE A LOT OF TALK AROUND THAT HE'S WON AN OSCAR (APPLAUSE) WON A NOBEL TIME FOR HIM TO GET IN, WHAT DO YOU KNOW, WHAT DO YOU HEAR, WHAT DO YOU THINK? THIS IS WHAT I KNOW I WAS QUOTED VERY ACCURATELY BY GEORGE WILL ON SUNDAY MORNING TELEVISION AS HAVING ONCE SAID THAT RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT WAS LIKE HAVING SEX YOU DIDN'T DO IT ONCE AND FORGET ABOUT IT, IT HAD UH...(LAUGHS) I DON'T HAVE ANY..THERE IS NO DOUBT IN MY MIND I HAVEN'T TALKED TO THE VICE PRESIDENT OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT THERE IS NO DOUBT IN MY MIND HE WOULD LIKE TO BE PRESIDENT, HE RAN IN 1988 AND HE RAN IN 2000 THE ONLY THING THAT WOULD STOP HIM ARE THE CIRCUMSTANCES AND THEY MAY NOT BE SUCH THAT HE WONT RUN, IN FACT I THINK THE ODDS ARE FROM WHAT ROY NEIL TOLD MY FRIEND PAUL BEGALLA THAT IT'S UNLIKELY THAT HE WILL BUT YOU MORE THAN ANYONE ELSE KNOW THAT WHEN SOMEBODY IS NOT RUNNING YOU KNOW THERE IS NO SHERMAN ANYWHERE IN THAT EITHER SO HE'S PROBABLY, HE HAS THE LUXURY OF BEING ABLE TO GET IN LATE I WOULDN'T BET TOTALLY AGAINST IT BUT I SURELY WOULDN'T BET ON IT WELL I THINK YOU WERE QUOTED SOMEWHERE RECENTLY AS SAYING YOU THOUGHT IT WAS MAYBE 25% I WAS AT THE PALMS THAT WAS A 2 1/2 BOURBON (LAUGHS) BUT I ALSO SAID OLD MISS WOULD COVER AND THEY DID SO I KIND OF HAD ONE RIGHT JIM ROOTENBERG OF THE TIMES CALLED ME AND SAID ANYTHING THAT I SAY AT THE PALMS YOU HAVE TO DISCOUNT

AS YOU WELL KNOW JAMES I DO OCCASIONALLY, VERY OCCASIONALLY TAKE BOURBON ONLY FOR MEDICINAL PURPOSES (LAUGHS) BUT I'D PLACE IT SOMEWHERE AT 25-30% THAT HE GETS IN BECAUSE THERE IS AN OPPORTUNITY BUT LETS TALK ABOUT TIME FRAME QUICKLY IF HE IS TO GET IN, MARK THE WORD IF DOESN'T HE OR DOES HE HAVE TO GET IN NEXT MONTH, 45 DAYS MAX YOU KNOW I'M SURE THAT SOME LAWYER IS DOING THAT HOW YOU GET IN AND HOW YOU GET IN ON THE BALLOT VARIES AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT THESE TIME ISSUES ARE TO THE IOWA CAUCUSES TALKING ABOUT VERY LIKELY THEY COULD MOVE THE NEW HAMPSHIRE PRIMARY TO DECEMBER IN THAT STATE THEY GIVE GREAT LATITUDE TO THE SECRETARY OF STATE THEY MIGHT HAVE IT, IF SOMEBODY TRIES IT THEY'LL HAVE IT THE DAY AFTER THE PREVIOUS ELECTION IF THEY HAVE TO BE FIRST SO THERE ARE KIND OF LEGAL ISSUES HE IS NOT FACED WITH AND THE ONLY WAY HE POSSIBLY HAS A CHANCE IS THAT IF OBAMA CONTINUES TO NOT SHOW MUCH OR STARTS FADING AND LOSES CONTACT WITH SENATOR CLINTON THEN HE MAY SEE THAT IT'S RIGHT BUT HE CAN RAISE MONEY, HE HAS PLENTY OF PERSONAL WEALTH HE'S MADE IT THE GOOGLE IPO OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT HE DOESN'T HAVE FINANCIAL PROBLEMS, HE DOESN'T HAVE NAME RECOGNITION AND I DOUBT IF HE WOULD HAVE ORGANIZATIONAL PROBLEMS IF HE GOT IN, IT WOULD BE A KIND OF JUST ADD WATER AND RUN KIND OF CAMPAIGN (LAUGHS) MY OWN GUESS IS THAT HE NEEDS TO GET IN THE NEXT 30-45 DAYS BUT THAT'S SHEER GUESS WORK ON MY PART YOUR RUNNING AGAINST THIS THING IS GETTING CLOSE EVEN IF THEY GO AS SCHEDULED IOWA CAUCUSES IS IN MID JANUARY SO IT'S GETTING TO BE THAT TIME NOW IF, IF VICE PRESIDENT DECIDES NOT TO GET IN COULD HE OR COULD HE NOT PLAY A KING MAKER ROLE FOR EXAMPLE THROW HIS SUPPORT BEHIND OBAMA YOU KNOW I DOUBT IT I MEAN HE THREW HIS SUPPORT BEHIND DEAN AND THAT DID HIM A LOT OF GOOD (LAUGHS) YOU KNOW DEMOCRATS ARE REFRESHINGLY AND STRANGELY PRETTY SATISFIED WITH THE STATE OF THINGS RIGHT NOW AND THAT'S NO THAT'S WHAT GORE IS LOOKING AT THERE IS NO KIND OF GEE WE GOTTA DO SOMETHING WE GOT TO GET SOMEBODY ELSE IN THIS RACE EVERY PIECE OF DATA THAT I'VE SEEN AND EVERY PIECE OF EVIDENCE TELLS ME THAT DEMOCRATS ARE BY AND LARGE WE FEEL FINE ABOUT OUR FIELD BUT WHAT IS HAPPENING HERE IS YOU KNOW WHERE MY SYMPATHIES ARE AND AS I SAY THERE WITH THE CHICK (LAUGHS) (APPLAUSE) I HAD THE REMARKABLE SATISFYING EXPERIENCE IN THE LAST ISSUE OF SPORTS ILLUSTRATED OF INTERVIEWING MYSELF NOW THERE'S A GOOD LINE OF WORK AND I ASKED MYSELF WHICH SPORT DOES THE CURRENT PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN REMIND YOU OF? AND I SAID GOLF, YOU KNOW IN GOLF YOU GOT TIGER WOODS AND EVERYBODY ELSE IN THIS CAMPAIGN YOU GOT HILLARY AND THE REST OF THE DUFFERS OUT THERE HACKING AWAY AT SOME ROCK REGARDLESS OF WHO YOUR FOR IT'S EVIDENT AT THIS POINT IN THE CAMPAIGN THAT SENATOR CLINTON IS IN TERMS OF RUNNING THE CAMPAIGN AND DOING THINGS RIGHT AND EXECUTING AND HAVING YOU KNOW THE THINGS THAT IT TAKES TO RUN A PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN SHE IS FAR AHEAD OF EVERYONE ELSE (APPLAUSE) WELL JAMES LET ME FOLLOW UP ON THAT VERY POINT THIS IS MY OWN OPINION AND CLEARLY LABELED AS SUCH AND AS THE LATE GREAT ED MURO SAID WHEN IT COMES TO OPINIONS MINE IS NOT WORTH ANYTHING MORE THAN THE GUY AT THE END OF THE BAR BEFORE I SAID DEMOCRATS ARE TOO COMPLACENT TOO SATISFIED, THAT REPUBLICANS ARE ACTUALLY LOOKING FORWARD TO RUNNING AGAINST SENATOR CLINTON OR OBAMA AMONG OTHER REASONS, SENATOR CLINTON BEING A WOMAN, OBAMA BEING OF AFRICAN-AMERICAN HERITAGE AND FROM WHERE I SIT THERE IS A GREAT OPPORTUNITY FOR THE REPUBLICANS TO REGROUP AND DESPITE GOING AGAINST THE ODDS WITH THE PRESIDENCY NEXT YEAR NOW TELL ME WHY I SHOULD NOT THINK THAT IF I INDEED I SHOULDN'T LOOK, I DON'T THINK THAT THERE IS ANY DOUBT THAT THE DEMOCRATS ARE IN AN ENVIABLE POSITION HERE AND WE CAN TALK ABOUT THAT A LITTLE BIT MORE AND AS I LIKE TO WHEN I SPEAK TO AUDIENCES I SAID I HAVE GOOD NEWS FOR THE DEMOCRATS AND REPUBLICANS FOR THE DEMOCRATS WE HAVE TO TALK OUR WAY OUT OF WINNING THIS ELECTION AND FOR THE REPUBLICANS I CAN ASSURE YOU AS BEING A LIFE LONG DEMOCRAT WE'RE PERFECTLY CAPABLE OF DOING THAT

THE REPUBLICANS THESE ARE THE THINGS THAT SHOULD WORRY DEMOCRATS FIRST OF ALL THE REPUBLICANS HAVE BECOME MUCH BETTER AT DOING THIS AS OF LATE THAN THE DEMOCRATS HAVE, THEY'RE TOUGHER, THEY'RE

TEND TO BAND TOGETHER, THEY HAVE A MUCH MORE EFFECTIVE ECHO CHAMBER IN OTHER WORDS IF SOMETHING GETS OUT AND THEY STAY ON THE MORNING PHONE CALL AND THEY DO THAT THE THIRD THING IS THAT THE LAST THREE ELECTIONS ODDLY ENOUGH THEY'VE DONE A LITTLE BET ON ELECTION DAY AND THEY'VE POLLED THAT HAPPENS MORE OFTEN THAN NOT IN THE WORLD AND IT'S BEEN MY EXPERIENCE CENTER RIGHT PARTIES TEND TO CLOSE A LITTLE BETTER AND SO YOU HAVE TO BE COGNIZANT OF THAT BUT HAVING SAID THAT, THE COUNTRY IS SO ANXIOUS AND SO WANTS TO MOVE ON FROM WHAT WE HAVE IT'S GOING TO BE A REMARKABLE FEAT FOR REPUBLICANS TO WIN THIS ELECTION I THINK EVERYBODY IN THE AUDIENCE KNOWS WHAT YOU DO LET ME HAVE YOU TRANSPOSE YOURSELF TO A REPUBLICAN CONSULTANT AND ADVISOR TO CANDIDATES, WHAT IS THEIR BIGGEST SINGLE WEAKNESS GOING INTO THIS PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN THE COUNTRY WANTS CHANGE AND BUSH IS LIKE IT'S ALMOST LIKE HE'S THIS PLAGUE TO THESE GUYS BECAUSE HE HAS LIKE A 33% APPROVAL BUT HE HAS LIKE A 70% APPROVAL AMONG REPUBLICANS SO THEY CAN'T REALLY BE A CHANGE CANDIDATE IN THE REPUBLICAN PRIMARY SO WHEN YOU WATCH STUFF YOU SEE IDIOCY LIKE OUR ECONOMY IS THE GREATEST IN THE WORLD AND CLEARLY A MAJORITY OF AMERICANS DON'T LIKE THE WAY THE ECONOMY IS GOING YOU HAVE THEM LIKE TRYING TO DEFEND THE WAR, TRYING TO DEFEND THE S CHIP VETO, TRYING TO DEFEND THE STEM CELL, TRYING TO DEFEND ALBERTO GONZALES ALFREDO.. (LAUGHS) SO THEIR BIGGEST CHALLENGE IS HOW DO YOU WATCH THESE GUYS AND SAY THEY'RE READY FOR CHANGE BECAUSE THAT'S CLEARLY WHAT 65 MAYBE SOMEWHERE BETWEEN 60-65% OF THE COUNTRY THE PRODUCT THAT THEY WANT TO BUY IS CHANGE BUT THEY WANT TO BUY SOMETHING DIFFERENT AND WHEN YOU LOOK AT THEM THEY ARE SELLING MORE OF THE SAME YOU HAVE GIULIANI SAYING THAT WE'RE GOING TO PAY FOR THE 800 BILLION DOLLARS THAT ITS GOING TO COST TO FIX THE AMT BUT CUTTING TAXES FURTHER AND PEOPLE ARE LIKE OH C'MON WE'VE SEEN THIS MOVIE BEFORE, PLEASE BUT BACK TO THE POINT WHAT IS THE GREATEST WEAKNESS OF THE DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATES DEMOCRATIC OR REPUBLICAN, YOU ASKED ME REPUBLICAN THEIR GREATEST WEAKNESS IS THAT THIS IS THE TIME WHERE THE COUNTRY IS CRAVING CHANGE AND THEY'RE UNABLE TO GIVE IT TO THEM IN THEIR PRIMARY THAT'S THE REPUBLICAN PARTY, THE GREATEST WEAKNESS OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY THERE ARE A LOT OF CRITICISMS MADE OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY THAT ARE NOT VALID THERE IS ONE THAT IS.. ONE OBSERVATION THAT IS MADE THAT IS ALL TOO VALID AND THAT IS IT OFTEN ACTS LIKE AN ACCUMULATION OF INTEREST GROUPS AS OPPOSED TO A NATIONAL PARTY LET ME INTERRUPT YOU FOR A SECOND, DOES IT APPEAR TO BE THAT WAY BECAUSE IT IS THAT WAY? I SAID IT WAS A VALID CRITICISM MANY ARE NOT, THAT WE'RE NOT PATRIOTIC OR FISCALLY RESPONSIBLE, I BURST OUT LAUGHING ON THAT, WE DON'T LOVE AMERICA WHATEVER, THAT'S ALL SILLINESS IN THE PAST IT HAS BEEN A VALID OBSERVATION THAT THE PARTY ACTS LIKE AN ACCUMULATION OF INTEREST GROUPS MORE THAN A NATIONAL PARTY DURING THE COURSE OF THIS CAMPAIGN I'M BECOMING ENCOURAGED THAT WE CAN BREAK OUT OF THAT AND NOT LAPSE BACK INTO THAT WHERE WE JUST GET THIS KIND OF LITANY OF 8 THINGS THAT WE FOUGHT LET ME TAKE IT ASIDE AND SPIN OFF OF THAT AND SAY AS DIFFICULT AS IT MAY BE IF SENATOR CLINTON IS NOT TO GET THE NOMINATION, WHAT WOULD THAT SCENARIO LOOK LIKE HOW COULD IT NOT GO HER WAY KNOWING THAT MY FEELING IS NOT A SINGLE VOTE HAS BEEN CAST AND WHILE IT CERTAINLY LOOKS GOOD FOR HER AT THE MOMENT THINGS CHANGE, WHAT WOULD IT TAKE FOR HER NOT TO BE THE FRONT RUNNER AND TO LOSE THE NOMINATION FIRST OF ALL, WHEN OBAMA STARTED THERE WAS A LOT OF ENTHUSIASM PEOPLE WANTED SOMETHING DIFFERENT, HE WAS A GUY THAT CAME ON HE HAD AN ENTIRELY DIFFERENT PERSONA HE WAS REALLY THE AGENT OF CHANGE IF HE WERE TO IGNITE AND TO BECOME THE SORT OF FACE OF CHANGE WITHIN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY AND HE WOULD CATCH A COUPLE OF THINGS HE COULD IT'S CONCEIVABLE THAT HE STILL COULD GET IT. I'M NOT DISCOUNTING THE FACT THAT I'M NOT SITTING HERE SAYING THAT MY CANDIDATE HAS THIS THING LOCKED UP BY ANY STRETCH OF THE IMAGINATION AND I DON'T THINK THAT THEY THINK THAT EITHER SO I MEAN IF ANY OF THE DEMOCRATS OR IF GORE GOT IN THERE IS ONLY THREE POSSIBLE DEMOCRATIC NOMINEES AND THAT'S SENATOR CLINTON, SENATOR OBAMA AND VICE PRESIDENT GORE AND VARYING DEGREES OF PROBABILITY BUT YEAH SURE I CAN SEE THAT HAPPENING THE CHANCES OF BECOMING SMALL AND SMALLER AS HE TENDS TO NOT DO AS WELL AS WE GET CLOSER AND CLOSER TO ELECTION DAY BUT IT WOULDN'T TAKE MUCH LET'S ASSUME THAT HE TIES HER IN IOWA CAUCUSES AND THERE'S THIS SORT OF GREAT WELL LOOK AND THE GUY HAS 300,000 CONTRIBUTORS HE HAS RAISED AN ENORMOUS JUST A STAGGERING AMOUNT OF MONEY FOR SOMEONE THAT HAD NO NATIONAL POLITICAL ORGANIZATION ON WHICH TO BUILD ON HE WAS DRAWING CROWDS OF 20 25,000 PEOPLE WHICH YOU AND I HAVE BEEN AROUND FOR A LONG TIME WE'RE NOT SEEING ANYTHING EVEN REMARKABLY CLOSE TO THAT AND THAT SAYS THAT THERE IS A REAL YEARNING AND DESIRE FOR SOMETHING DIFFERENT IN THE COUNTRY AND A LOT OF PEOPLE VESTED THAT IN SENATOR OBAMA WHEN HE STARTED HE'S DONE A GOOD JOB OF YOU KNOW GETTING IN THAT CONVERSATION IF YOU WILL WHAT ABOUT THE CRITICISM JAMES, INCLUDING SOME OF MY OWN THAT PARTICULARLY WITH SENATOR CLINTON WE'LL GET TO THE REPUBLICANS IN A MINUTE LET'S JUST FORGET EM -IT'S THE MORE INTERESTING SIDE OF THE RACE (LAUGHS) SHE DOESN'T WANT TO TAKE A FIRM POSITION ON VARY MANY THINGS IRAQ, SOCIAL SECURITY, NATIONAL DEBT, THE DEFICIT, SHE'S AT LEAST CREATED THE PERCEPTION THAT SHE'S PLAYING IT SAFE, DOESN'T WANT TO COMMIT AT A TIME WHEN THE ELECTORATE SEEMS TO BE YEARNING FOR SOMEBODY TO TELL US WHAT YOUR GOING TO DO SPELL OUT FOR US WHAT YOUR GOING TO DO, SPEAK OF WHAT YOU STAND NOW FIRST OF ALL DO YOU AGREE WITH THE CRITICISM ? NO. I MEAN AI AGREE THAT SHE DOESN'T WANT TO..I'VE NEVER KNOWN A CANDIDATE THAT STOOD UP AND SAID WHAT THEY WERE GOING TO DO ON SOCIAL SECURITY WHEN'S THE LAST TIME WELL HOW ABOUT IRAQ WELL I THINK SHE'S BEEN PRETTY CLEAR THAT SHE WANTS..SHE'S VOTED SOMETIMES THE NATURE OF A QUAGMIRE IS A QUAGMIRE BUT SHE'S BEEN PRETTY CLEAR IN ALL OF HER VOTES THAT SHE WOULD BEGIN A WITHDRAWAL SHE'S ALSO BEEN CLEAR THAT SHE WASN'T JUST GOING TO UP AND LEAVE INSTANTLY PEOPLE..WE ASSUME THERE IS ONLY ONE POSITION THAT YOUR GOING TO KEEP 160,000 PEOPLE THERE OR YOUR GOING TO HAVE NOBODY THERE TOMORROW WELL THERE IS ANOTHER POSITION I MEAN YOU LOOK AT SENATOR BIDEN HAS ONE BUT I THINK THAT (APPLAUSE) I THINK THAT HER VOTES HAVE BEEN YOU KNOW PRETTY CONSISTENT AND IT'S NOT LIKE SHE HASN'T LIKE SHIED AWAY AS A TYPICAL FRONT RUNNER, SHE CERTAINLY HASN'T RUN AWAY FROM THE DEBATES IF I SEE THEM DEBATE ONE MORE TIME I'M GOING TO LITERALLY, I CAN'T WATCH IT ANYMORE SO YOU DON'T AGREE THAT WITH THIS PERCEPTION WHICH IS THE PERCEPTION AT LEAST IS THERE THAT SHE'S TRYING TO STAY IN THE MIDDLE, MOVE WITH THE MASS, NOT COMMIT HERSELF CLASSIC CASE OF FEELING SHE HAS A LEAD AND PLAYING IT SAFE I AGREE THAT SHE DOESN'T WANT TO MOVE.. I'VE WATCHED A LOT OF PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGNS AND I'VE BEEN INVOLVED IN THEM THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A MORE HONEST CAMPAIGN THAN SENATOR CLINTONS AND I SAY HONEST, LET ME TELL YOU WHY I SAY THAT WHAT YOU SEE IS REFLECTIVE OF THE KIND OF PERSON SHE IS YOUR RIGHT IT'S NOT A BIG SWING, IT'S THOUGHT OUT, IT'S PLANNED IT'S COMPETENT IT'S NOT HERKEY JERKEY IT DOESN'T DEAL IN BIG BROAD THINGS AND THAT'S WHO SHE IS, SHE IS NOT A FRIVOLOUS PERSON SHE'S A SERIOUS PERSON, SHE TAKES THINGS SERIOUSLY, SHE TAKES THE CAMPAIGN SERIOUSLY, SHE HAS TALENTED, COMPETENT PEOPLE AROUND HER BUT I THINK THAT PRETTY MUCH IS THE KIND OF PERSON THAT SHE IS SHE DOESN'T, SHE'S NOT KNOWN FOR HER SOARING RHETORIC IN APOPLECTIC LANGUAGE AND HERE WE ARE WE STAND ON THE PRECIPICE, WE CAN DO NO OTHER THE FATE OF HUMANITY YOU KNOW THAT'S NOT THE WAY THAT SHE SPEAKS, THAT'S NOT THE WAY THAT HER CAMPAIGN IS SO I THINK THAT WHAT YOU SEE IN HER CAMPAIGN IS VERY

VERY MUCH A REFLECTION OF WHAT THE PUBLIC SENATOR CLINTON IS AND I THINK IT'S GOING TO BE THE KIND OF PRESIDENCY THAT SHE'LL HAVE LET'S MOVE TO THE REPUBLICAN SIDE AS OF THIS MOMENT RUDOLPH GIULIANI THE MOST LIKELY REPUBLICAN NOMINEE OR NOT? (HISSES) (LAUGHS)

I KNOW A LOT OF REPUBLICANS, I'M MARRIED TO ONE THEY'RE IN MY FAMILY, THERE IS A LARGE ...LOOK WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THIS IS SOMETHING PEOPLE NEED TO REALIZE OF PEOPLE OF SELF-IDENTIFIED DEMOCRATS 21% ARE AFRICAN-AMERICAN OF SELF IDENTIFIED REPUBLICANS 24% ARE EVANGELICAL CONSERVATIVE CHRISTIANS IN OTHER WORDS EVANGELICAL CONSERVATIVE CHRISTIANS ARE A LARGER PART OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY THAN AFRICAN-AMERICANS ARE IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY NOW, IF THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT IT WAS GOING TO BE A ROMP IN PROMINENT AFRICAN-AMERICANS WERE TALKING ABOUT RUNNING SOMEBODY ELSE AND TAKING A THIRD OR HALF OF THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN VOTE AWAY FROM THE DEMOCRAT I GUARANTEE YOU THEY WOULD BE ANGST IN MY PARTY THE LIKES OF WHICH WE MIGHT HAVE NEVER SEEN THAT'S #1, #2 IS THAT YOU KNOW THE PRESIDENT OF THE ROTARY CLUB IN KOKOMO IS NOT GOING TO BE TOO IMPRESSED WITH A GUY THAT'S BEEN MARRIED THREE TIMES WHOSE KIDS DON'T SPEAK TO HIM AND HIS DAUGHTER HAS ENDORSED OBAMA AND THE TRADITIONAL YOU KNOW IF YOU THINK ABOUT THIS OF ALL THOSE REPUBLICANS GIULIANI AND FRED THOMPSON AND ROMNEY AND MCCAIN THE ONLY ONE WITH ONE WIFE IS THE MORMON (LAUGHS)

BUT

I DON'T SEE IT AND IF HE DOES IT WILL BE A FRACTURED PARTY I DON'T THINK THERE IS A BETTER, IF PEOPLE SAY WHAT'S THE BEST SCENARIO FOR THE DEMOCRATS, THE BEST SCENARIO FOR THE DEMOCRATS IS, AND WATCH HUCKABEE IF YOU GO ON TO THE WINDOW IF YOUR NO HORSE PLAYER AND YOU GOT 2$ RATTLING AROUND IN YOUR POCKET AND YOUR WALKING AWAY TAKE A TICKET ON OLD HUCKABEE HERE HE WILL PAY A GOOD PRICE AND HE'LL CAUSE SOME ANGST IN THERE IS ANYBODY NOT RUNNING AT THE PRESENT TIME, I'M THINKING OF MAYBE THE GOVERNOR OF FLORIDA ANY CHANCE THAT SOMEBODY FROM THE OUTSIDE COULD GET IN LOOK DO YOU KNOW THE LAST TIME AT THIS POINT IN THE REPUBLICAN PARTY PRESIDENTIAL NOMINATING PROCESS THERE HASN'T BEEN A DESIGNATED OBVIOUS FRONT RUNNER IN SAID DESIGNATED OBVIOUS FRONT RUNNER WAS NOT THE NOMINEE 1940 WENDELL WILKE EVERY PRESIDENTIAL CYCLE FROM 1944 TO 2004 AT THIS POINT WE KNEW WHO THE REPUBLICAN NOMINEE WAS GOING TO BE WE DON'T KNOW THAT JEB BUSH IS THE OBVIOUS REPUBLICAN NOMINEE, HE'S THE TWICE GOVERNOR OF A LARGE SWING STATE HE SPEAKS SPANISH, HE'S IN WITH THE SOCIAL CONSERVATIVES, HE'S A GOOD POLITICIAN AND THE ONLY REASON THAT HE'S NOT THE NOMINEE IS THAT HIS LAST NAME IS BUSH BUT IF YOUR LOOKING AT RIGHT NOW THE REPUBLICAN PARTY AND THIS THING IN MY OPINION IS GOING TO GET VERY DICEY AND VERY PROBLEMATIC FOR THEM WHAT I BELIEVE IS THIS, AS A DEMOCRAT WOULD I WANT TO RUN AGAINST I DON'T CARE WHO THE CANDIDATE IS, I JUST WANT THAT PARTY TO BE DIVIDED AND DISPIRITED (LAUGHS)

AND I'M NOT, THERE ARE REPUBLICANS THAT HAVE FIGURED THIS OUT TOO, I'M NOT THE ONLY PERSON THAT'S GOT THIS THING FIGURED OUT OKAY ? AND THE ONLY CANDIDATE THAT I SEE THAT WOULD HAVE ANY CHANCE OF UNITING THE REPUBLICAN PARTY WOULD BE JEB BUSH WHERE EVERYBODY BUT REPUBLICANS..LOOK THERE IS AN OLD LINE DEMOCRATS FALL IN LOVE, REPUBLICANS FALL IN LINE WELL THEY AIN'T LINING UP BEHIND ONE GUY RIGHT NOW, THEY LINED UP ALL OVER THE PLACE AND THE ONLY ONE THAT THEY WOULD FALL IN LINE WITH IS JEB BUSH THAT'S WHY I DO NOT DISCOUNT THE POSSIBILITY THAT LOOK THE SENIOR KIND OF PEOPLE IN THE REPUBLICAN PARTY ARE GOING TO SAY GOVERNOR YOU'VE GOT TO COME HERE, THEY'RE NOT USED TO THIS KIND OF DISORDER WE DEMOCRATS WE GET IN A ROOM WITH 5 PEOPLE, WE GOT 6 OPINIONS AND WHAT THE HELL YOU TALKING ABOUT AND SHUT UP AND THIS AND THAT AND THEY'RE ALL GEE BIFFY WHAT IS IT WE'RE AGREEING ON TODAY WE GOT TO ALL PULL TOGETHER HERE AND GET ANOTHER TAX CUT

MAYBE THERE IS A WAR WE CAN START SOMEWHERE AROUND THE WORLD (APPLAUSE) JAMES IN POLITICS AND CERTAINLY IN JOURNALISM ONE TENDS TO BE VERY SUSPICIOUS OF THE SO CALLED "CONVENTIONAL WISDOM" THE CONVENTIONAL WISDOM NOW IS THAT EACH OF THE TWO PARTIES, BOTH PARTIES WILL HAVE THEIR NOMINEES CERTAINLY BY THE END OF FEBRUARY AND POSSIBLY EARLY IN FEBRUARY, LET'S DISCUSS THAT FOR JUST A MOMENT, IS THAT A CINCH OR IS THERE SOME POSSIBILITY, SOME REAL POSSIBILITY THAT ONE OR BOTH PARTIES COULD GO TO THE CONVENTION BEFORE THEY HAVE THE NOMINEES WELL IF I WAS A BETTING MAN, COME TO THINK OF IT I AM I..UH I THINK THE DEMOCRATS WILL BE SORTED OUT PRETTY EARLY BECAUSE THERE ARE FEWER CANDIDATES AND IT'S KIND OF HARD TO SEE THAT IT DOESN'T GET SORTED OUT PRETTY SOON I DON'T KNOW IF IT WILL GO TO CONVENTION BUT I THINK THE REPUBLICANS ARE GOING TO GO DEEP INTO THEIR PROCESS I DON'T THINK IT'S GOING TO BE A KIND OF THING WHERE SOMEBODY JUST AUTOMATICALLY EMERGES I DON'T SEE THE MAP WORKING LIKE THAT NOW WHETHER IT GOES TO CONVENTION, HOW MUCH FUN WOULD THAT BE? ONE COULD ONLY HOPE I MEAN GOOD YEAR FOR AN INDEPENDENT TO GET INTO THE RACE? A SERIOUS INDEPENDENT -SURE ROSS PEROT CUT COULD BE SOMEBODY OF THE LOU DOBBS CUT YOU KNOW A TANCREDO OR SOMEBODY LIKE THAT COULD BE SOMEBODY MADE IN PART OF A LARGE AMERICAN CITY CUT YOU DON'T KNOW BUT YES, THE CONDITIONS ARE RIPE BUT WE GO BACK TO THE THING ABOUT RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT WHEN GORE GETS IN THERE THE BALLOT ASSESS AS TO HOW THEY DO AND WHAT IS A LOGISTICAL PROBLEM OF SOME DIFFICULTY BUT I WOULDN'T BE, GIULIANI IS THE NOMINEE THERE WOULD BE A SOCIAL CONSERVATIVE NATIVOUS KIND OF CANDIDATE OUT THERE THAT WOULD CAUSE THEM SOME REAL GRIEF AND WOULD THAT INSURE A DEMOCRATIC VICTORY WELL I DON'T KNOW OF ANYTHING INSURES BUT I WOULD BE FOR IT, I THINK THAT THE PROCESS COULD STAND SOMEBODY OFFERING AN ALTERNATIVE DEAL TO THE REPUBLICAN PARTY I THINK THERE NEED TO BE TWO REPUBLICANS IN THERE JAMES, THE OVERRIDING ISSUE FROM WHERE WE SIT NOW, WHAT IS, WHAT WILL CONTINUE TO BE IN YOUR JUDGMENT THE OVERRIDING ISSUE OF THE NEXT PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN. IS IT IRAQ STUPID? YOU KNOW I THINK IT DOESN'T SEEM LIKE THEY CAN GET ANYTHING DONE I THINK WHEN PEOPLE LOOK AT AMERICAN POLITICS, THEY LOOK AT BUSH IT'S LIKE WE NEED TO HAVE A GOVERNMENT THAT KIND OF RECONNECTS WITH US AND WE NEED TO HAVE PEOPLE IN WASHINGTON THAT CAN SIT DOWN AND QUIT TALKING AT EACH OTHER AND TALK TO EACH OTHER AND I THINK THAT OVERRIDINGLY THAT'S WHAT PEOPLE, YES, ITS IRAQ, ITS HEALTHCARE YOU GO AND YOU TRY TO RANK THESE THINGS BUT I THINK RIGHT NOW PEOPLE ARE JUST SO TURNED OFF BY THE WAY THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION HAS TRIED TO DIVIDE THE COUNTRY AND ALSO YOU CAN'T JUST UNDERPLAY JUST A SHEER INCOMPETENCE THAT PEOPLE DON'T HAVE ANY FAIT THAT THEIR GOVERNMENT CAN DO TO MOST BASIC THINGS ANYMORE AND THEY DON'T TRUST IT SO THE BIG CHALLENGE OF THE NEXT PRESIDENT IS GOING TO BE TO RESTORE TRUST WITH THE AMERICAN PEOPLE, TO RESTORE AMERICAN CREDIBILITY AROUND THE WORLD AND THOSE TWO THINGS I THINK CAN BE DONE RELATIVELY QUICKLY BUT UNTIL THEIR ACCOMPLISHED IT'S REALLY GOING TO BE HARD TO GET PEOPLE TO GO ALONG WITH SOME OF THE LARGER THINGS DID I READ YOU CORRECTLY IT'S YOUR JUDGMENT THAT PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE LOOKING TO IS SAY WHO AMONG THESE CANDIDATES, LET'S JUST SAY ITS REPUBLICAN OR DEMOCRAT WHO IS THE MOST COMPETENT AND WHO CAN BRING THE COUNTRY BACK TOGETHER AGAIN OR AS MANY NOT MANY REPUBLICANS SAY IT'S STILL GOING TO BE IRAQ WELL YOU GOTTA BRING THE COUNTRY TOGETHER ON IRAQ I MEAN THE NEW PRESIDENT HAS TO COME IN AND GIVE US WHAT WE HAVEN'T HAD, AN HONEST ASSESSMENT OF WHAT IT IS AND AN IDEA OF WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO BUT THAT'S GOING TO BE PART OF WHAT THE NEW PRESIDENT IS GOING TO HAVE TO DO THIS IS A COUNTRY THAT DOESN'T, RIGHT NOW WE LOOK AT IRAQ, WE LOOK AT HEALTHCARE WE LOOK AT THE ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUES THAT WE FACE WE LOOK AT THE FISCAL ISSUES WE FACE, WE'RE A COUNTRY WHO WOULD PREFER NOT TO BE DIVIDED WE REALLY WOULD AND I THINK THAT'S THE MOST OVERRIDING THING RIGHT NOW IS ASK IT BE THE FEDERAL THE NEW PRESIDENT IS GOING TO HAVE TO REESTABLISH THE TRUST OF THE AMERICAN PEOPLE AND THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO REESTABLISH AMERICAN CREDIBILITY AROUND THE WORLD THE GOOD NEWS IS I THINK THEY'LL BE ABLE TO DO THAT BUT BEFORE THEY CAN TACKLE OTHER THINGS, THAT IS SORT OF JOB 1 ON THE AGENDA (APPLAUSE) LET'S TALK ABOUT PRESS COVERAGE FOR A MINUTE GIVE ME YOUR ASSESSMENT OF HOW GOOD OR HOW BAD YOU THINK PRESS COVERAGE OF POLITICS AND PARTICULARLY THE PRESIDENT'S GOING TO BE IT WAS THE WORST I'VE EVER SEEN IN 2000 AND I'LL SAY THIS RIGHT NOW I HOPE THAT THE PEOPLE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE NEW YORK TIMES AND THE WASHINGTON COVERAGE OF THE 2000 PRESIDENTIAL RACE I HOPE THAT THEY SAW WHAT AN ABJECT DISASTROUS FAILURE THAT THIS ADMINISTRATION IS AND WHEN THEY SAW AL GORE GET THE NOBEL PRIZE BECAUSE THE COVERAGE OF THE NEW YORK TIMES WAS BORDERLINE CRIMINAL THAT'S A FACT AND THE COVERAGE OF THE POST WAS WORSE AND ITS INDEFENSIBLE WHAT THEY DID IT IS ABSOLUTELY INDEFENSIBLE (APPLAUSE) FIRST OF ALL I'M HAPPY TO HEAR JAMES YOU DO NOT FEEL STRONGLY ABOUT THE TIMES AND WASHINGTON POST COVERAGE I'M NOT OVER THE 2000 ELECTION AND I'M NEVER GOING TO GET OVER IT (APPLAUSE)

I DON'T WANT TO GET OVER IT, I WANT TO FEEL THAT PAIN EVERYDAY OF WHAT THEY DID I DON'T WANT TO FORGET ABOUT IT AND I DON'T WANT A SINGLE DEMOCRAT TO EVER FORGET WHAT HAPPENED IN 2000

WHAT SPECIFICALLY, YOU SAID THE TIMES AND THE POST I BELIEVE YOU USED THE WORD CRIMINAL I MEAN IT IN A TERM OF JOURNALISTICALLY GIVE ME A SPECIFIC GORE NEVER SAID HE INVENTED THE INTERNET AND THEY KEPT REPEATING IT THAT GORE.. I MEAN FROM EVERYTHING TO COVERING WHAT KIND OF CLOTHES HE WEARS READ EVERY PIECE OF THING THAT YOU CAN, EVERYTHING HE DID WAS COMPLETELY EXAGGERATED, EVERY GORE THING WAS COMPLETELY EXAGGERATED, BUSH WAS COMPLETELY COVERED UP NEVER PUT TO ANY KIND OF A GRILLING AND EVEN FROM THE RIDICULOUS STUFF LIKE HE CLAIMED HE WAS THE BASIS OF LOVE STORY FOR WHICH HE NEVER DID TO THERE'S JUST FACT, AFTER FACT, AFTER FACT, THAT THE TIMES IN THE POST BOUGHT CONSISTENTLY AND I WISH THAT SOMEBODY WOULD, WHAT THEY OUGHT TO DO IS JUST APOLOGIZE TO THE COUNTRY FOR WHAT THEY DID TO IT AND WE'D ALL BE OVER IT WE'LL INVITE THEM SOME WEEKEND INVITE ME WITH EM JAMES, TAKING THE PRESS AS A WHOLE AND MOVING NOW TO THE PRESENT YOU WANT ME TO JUST MOVE FROM 2000 AND OUT ? OKAY WHAT DO YOU SEE? WHAT DO YOU HEAR? WHAT DO YOU READ NOW THAT WOULD BE INSTRUCTIVE TO US PARTICULARLY ON THE POINT OF WHY THE PRESS AND I DO NOT EXCLUDE MYSELF FROM THIS CRISIS IT SEEMS TO BE TIMID IN THE ERA OF ASKING THE TOUGH QUESTIONS AND PARTICULARLY A TOUGH FOLLOW UP QUESTION SEEMS TO BE BEHIND US

WE HAVE NOW IS WHEN YOU AND I WE'RE GROWING UP AND MANY PEOPLE IN THIS ROOM YOU GOT, WHEN I LIVED IN LOUISIANA YOU READ THE MORNING ADVOCATE WHICH WAS THE BATON ROUGE PAPER AND IF YOU WERE REALLY KIND OF INFORMED LIKE MY FAMILY WAS YOU GOT THE NEW ORLEANS PAPER AND THAT WAS IT AND YOU HAD TO KIND OF EVENING NEWS AND BOOM AND NOW YOU GOT I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY CABLE T.V.S YOU GO AND BATON ROUGE YOU CAN GET THE BATON ROUGE PAPER, THE NEW ORLEANS PAPER, THE NEW YORK TIMES, THE FINANCIAL TIMES, THE WALL STREET JOURNAL THE USA TODAY LIKE A WHOLE NEWSSTAND AVAILABLE TO PEOPLE I DON'T KNOW IF ALL OF THIS KNOWLEDGE IS I DON'T KNOW IF IT HAS MADE US ANY SMARTER THE PRESS ITS LIKE SOMEBODY SAYS IT'S THE PRESS AND IT'S AN IDENTIFIABLE THING WELL IT'S REALLY NOT YOU KNOW THESE CANDIDATES HAVE WAY MORE DEBATES NOW THAN THEY'VE EVER HAD THEY'VE, HOW MANY DEBATES HAVE I SEEN ON T.V. AM I WRONG, I MUST HAVE SEEN THE DEMOCRATS DEBATE 7 OR 8 TIMES IT SEEMS LIKE IT, I COULD BE WRONG NO BETWEEN THE TWO PARTIES THERE HAVE BEEN DOZENS AT LEAST TWO DOZEN MY WIFE TOLD ME SHE'S GOING DOWN TO ORLANDO, THERE'S A REPUBLICAN DEBATE DOWN THERE SUNDAY SHE'S A FRED THOMPSON LOOK, THERE'S SOMETHING TO BE SAID FOR HIM, BALD, TALL, SOUTHERN GUY WHO HAS BEEN IN THE MOVIES AND HAS GOT A YOUNGER RIGHT WING WIFE, MAYBE I'LL RUN FOR PRESIDENT

AND IT'S TIME NOW FOR US TO MOVE INTO THE AUDIENCE QUESTIONS AND IF YOU WOULD DO US A GREAT FAVOR OF SPEAK UP, SPEAK AS RIGHT INTO THE MICROPHONE BECAUSE TO TELL YOU THE TRUTH JAMES IS NOT GETTING ANY YOUNGER AND HIS HEARING IS NOT WHAT IT OUGHT TO BE WHAT'D YOU SAY I'M SORRY? (LAUGHS) READY TO TAKE YOUR QUESTIONS SO DO WE HAVE A QUESTION ON THE RIGHT A LOT OF PEOPLE I'VE SPOKEN TO ARE AFRAID THAT HILLARY CLINTON CANNOT GET ELECTED SO I WANTED TO ASK WHAT THE ANSWER TO THAT IS THEY FEEL THAT FIRST OF ALL IF YOU GATHER A GROUP OF DEMOCRATS TOGETHER YOUR GOING TO FIND HALF OF THEM DON'T LIKE HER AND CAN'T EXPLAIN WHY SECONDLY THEY'RE AFRAID THAT SHE CAN'T CAPTURE THE COLLEGE EDUCATED MALES THEY'RE AFRAID OF AN EROSION AMONG THE BLUE COLLAR MALES AND THEY'RE AFRAID THAT THERE MAY BE SOME KIND OF HIDDEN SUBSURFACE DISLIKE OF STRONG WOMEN ACROSS A BROAD SWATH OF THE COUNTRY NOW I'M NOT SAYING THAT I DON'T THINK THAT SHE WOULD MAKE A GOOD PRESIDENT BUT WE'RE TERRIFIED OF LOSING THIS ELECTION AND WE'RE TERRIBLY AFRAID THAT SOMEBODY, AND THIS IS A QUESTION, THAT NADER COULD COME IN AND CAPTURE SOME, HE SAID HE'S RUNNING COULD HE CAPTURE SOME OF THESE FRINGE ANTI-IRAQ WAR DEMOCRATS JAMES TAKE A SWING AT THAT THANK YOU FOR YOUR OPTIMISM (LAUGHS) ANYBODY GOT A PEPTO-BISMOL HERE (LAUGHS) LET ME START WITH THE END FIRST DO I WORRY ABOUT A NADER GETTING IN AND SKIMMING VOTES OFF? OF COURSE I DO, CLEARLY I DO IN TERMS OF HILLARY'S ELECT ABILITY AND I REFER TO YOU TO GO LOOK UP THE LADY'S ABC WASHINGTON POST POLL AND THIS HAS BEEN CONSISTENT OF LATE IS THERE ARE MORE PEOPLE THAT SAY THAT THEY WONT VOTE FOR GIULIANI OR MCCAIN OR THOMPSON UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES THAN SAY THEY WONT VOTE FOR HILLARY HER NUMBER IS DOWN TO LIKE 41 AMERICAN POLITICS IS NOT A STAGNANT THING, JUST BECAUSE SOMETHING IS TRUE TODAY AND I THINK SHE'S MADE SOME REMARKABLE PROGRESS IN THIS CYCLE ARE THERE SOME PEOPLE WONT VOTE FOR HER BECAUSE SHE IS A STRONG WOMAN YEAH, I'M KIND OF PARTIAL TO STRONG WOMEN, I WAS RAISED BY ONE AND I'M MARRIED TO ONE AND I'M TRYING TO RAISE TWO OF THEM MYSELF, I KIND OF LIKE EM

(APPLAUSE) YOU KNOW IT'S UNKNOWN IN ITSELF TO A LOT OF PEOPLE IT SEEMS LIKE GEE THE DEMOCRATS ARE REALLY IN A GOOD POSITION HERE IN WHY RISK IT AND WHY SHOULDN'T WE GO WITH SOMEONE SAFE, WELL WHO'S SAFE? AND I THINK THE TRUTH OF THE MATTER IS THERE IS LITTLE EVIDENCE FROM ANY POLLING OR FOCUS GROUPS THAT I'VE SEEN THAT SHE'S NOT SHE' POPULAR AMONG DEMOCRATS, VERY POPULAR IN FACT AND THERE IS A REMARKABLE SATISFACTION BUT WILL THEY GEAR UP AND WILL THE RIGHT WING YOU KNOW SLIME MACHINE OR WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL IT YOU KNOW BUT LET ME TELL YOU SOMETHING, AND YOU TAKE SOLACE IN THIS, IT'S PRETTY HARD TO SWIFT BODE A CLINTON, I'VE BEEN AROUND THEM (APPLAUSE) JAMES LET ME FOLLOW UP ON THAT, HOW MUCH TENSION, I THINK THIS GOES PARTLY TO THE CORE OF THE GENTLEMAN'S QUESTION THERE IS THIS TENSION BETWEEN GRASS ROOTS DEMOCRATS NET ROOTS DEMOCRATS AND CENTRUS SO DOES THIS PLAY INTO THE QUESTION OF ELECT ABILITY? OR YOU THINK THAT SOCIETY... ARE THERE PEOPLE IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY THAT ARE WORRIED ABOUT THIS, SURE. ABSOLUTELY ARE THEY'RE PEOPLE IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY THAT SAYS WE TRY TO MOVE TOO CLOSE TO THE CENTER OR TOO MUCH TO THE LEFT, OF COURSE THERE ARE BUT I GOTTA BE FAIR HERE TOO, I'VE NEVER SEEN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY MORE UNITED THAN IT IS RIGHT NOW YOU LOOK AT THE WAY THAT THE CONGRESS ACTS UP ON THE VOTES THEY TAKE IT'S THE HIGHEST AMOUNT OF PARTY DISCIPLINE WE'VE SEEN THAT THE MARGIN BETWEEN PEOPLE WHO HAVE A FAVORABLE VIEW BUT THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY AND THE REPUBLICAN PARTY IS AS HIGH AS I'VE SEEN IT IN POLLING EVERY POLL THAT YOU LOOK AT SAYS DEMOCRATS ARE MORE ENTHUSIASTIC ABOUT THEIR PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATES THAN THE REPUBLICANS ARE SO IF THERE ARE 10 INDICATORS, 9 DON'T POINT TO THE DEMOCRATS 10 DO LET'S GO TO THIS SIDE OF THE ROOM THE GENTLEMAN HALFWAY DOWN MR. CARVILLE ASSUMING THE PROBABILITY THAT HILLARY WILL BE THE NOMINEE FOR PRESIDENT IN YOUR SITUATION WHO DO YOU THINK WOULD BE THE BEST POSSIBLE CANDIDATE FOR V.P. (LAUGHS) OH THANK YOU I HAVE MY CANDIDATE, DRUM ROLL PLEASE (LAUGHS) KATHLEEN SEBELIUS GOVERNOR OF KANSAS 75% APPROVAL RATING HER FATHER JOHN GILLIGAN WAS THE GOVERNOR OF OHIO, MODERATE, GETS STUFF DONE SUCCESSFUL IN A RED STATE, YOU CAN'T TAKE ONE WOMAN, HELL GIVE EM TWO (APPLAUSE)

BY THE WAY IF SHE DID EVERYBODY WOULD SAY WELL, BUT.., SHE'S NOT.. THEY WOULDN'T SAY IT'S A TYPICAL POLITICAL THING AND SHE'S TRYING TO DO WHATEVER IT WOULD GO LIKE WHOA WHO IS THIS WHAT IS THIS SO THAT'S MY DARK HORSE CANDIDATE AND I DON'T KNOW GOVERNOR SEBELIUS BUT SHE IS I'VE OBSERVED HER AND I'VE BEEN IN KANSAS, REMARKABLE YOU HEARD IT HERE FIRST (APPLAUSE) YOU SAY THAT'S YOUR DARK HORSE, LET'S TALK NON-DARK HORSE I TAKE YOUR POINT, STRANGER THINGS HAVE HAPPENED THE WOMEN FOLK ARE COMING (APPLAUSE) DOSE SENATOR CLINTON NEED SOMEONE WITH DEMONSTRATED MILITARY EXPERIENCE I'M SURE THAT THERE ARE SEVERAL MODELS THAT PEOPLE USE TO PICK VICE PRESIDENTS, FIRST OF ALL IT IS RELATIVELY COMMON THAT THEY PICK ONE OF THEIR PRIMARY OPPONENTS KENNEDY DID IT WITH JOHNSON, REGAN DID IT WITH BUSH AND JOHN KERRY DID IT WITH EDMONDS GENERALLY THAT'S BECAUSE THERE IS SOME KIND OF FRACTION OF PARTY THAT YOU CAN KIND OF BRING EVERYBODY TOGETHER IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE THAT SHE IS GOING TO..IF SHE IS THE NOMINEE THE PARTY IS GOING TO BE PRETTY UNITED, I DON'T THINK THAT SHE IS GOING TO HAVE TO PICK A VICE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE FROM A CERTAIN WING OF THE PARTY TO UNITE THE PARTY THE DEMOCRATS I THINK WITH JUSTIFICATION WOULD YOU KNOW LIKE TO TAKE AWAY AS MUCH WE'RE RUNNING PRETTY CLOSE TO THE REPUBLICANS NOW ON THE WHOLE NATIONAL SECURITY ISSUE, IF YOU TOOK OVER RETIRED GENERAL LOUIS CLARK OR GENERAL ZINNEY OR SOMEONE LIKE THAT I DON'T KNOW I'M JUST THROWING NAMES BUT WITHOUT BEING SPECIFIC ABOUT A NAME THAT IS CLEARLY ONE KIND OF DIRECTION TO GO IN, ANOTHER ONE WOULD BE SOMEBODY THAT MIGHT BE ABLE TO CARRY A STATE, ONE OF THE NAMES THAT WE TALKED ABOUT I WOULD THROW OUT IS INDIANA SENATOR BAYH WHO IS SUPPORTING HER AND SENATOR CLINTON HAS A HISTORY IN INDIANA SHE RAN A CARTER CAMPAIGN I THINK IT WAS IN 1980 HE IS A HIGHLY RESPECTED GUY KIND OF A MODERATE WOULD BE THAT WOULD BE A CHOICE, PEOPLE WOULD SAY WELL THAT MAKES SENSE CENTEROUS DEMOCRAT FROM A RED STATE, ETC, ETC THERE ARE ANY NUMBER OF OTHER PEOPLE THAT WOULD BE POSSIBLE I WANT TO GET TO ANOTHER QUESTION BUT BEFORE I DO SO I'M GOING TO PUT YOU BACK INTO YOUR POLITICAL CONSULTANT MODE WHICH IS YOUR NATURAL NEST IF I'M SENATOR CLINTON WHY NOT ANNOUNCE NOW IF ELECTED I WILL MAKE BILL CLINTON MY SECRETARY OF STATE (LAUGHS) BECAUSE I DON'T THINK I THINK THAT BEFORE THE CAMPAIGN WAS OVER THAT THE AMERICAN PUBLIC WILL HAVE A PRETTY GOOD IDEA OF WHAT PRESIDENT CLINTON'S ROLE WILL BE AND I I DON'T KNOW THIS BUT TO ME THERE IS JUST ONE OBVIOUS POSITION IN THIS WORLD FOR BILL CLINTON AND THAT'S SECRETARY GENERAL OF THE U.N. BUT IT MAKES SO MUCH SENSE IT'LL NEVER HAPPEN (LAUGHS) THIS GENTLEMAN RIGHT HERE THE QUESTION IS ONE THAT WASN'T COVERED IN YOUR INTERVIEW AND I THINK IS VERY IMPORTANT IN THIS ELECTION, IT'S THE ROLE OF MONEY BECAUSE FUND RAISING HAS BEEN DOMINATING THE NEWS, DOMINATING THE COVERAGE AT THE EXPENSE OF THE DISCUSSION ON ISSUES DO YOU THINK THAT THIS IS A ONE TIME TREND OR WILL MONEY CONTINUE TO DOMINATE U.S. POLITICS FOR YEARS TO COME IN THIS WAY AND PERHAPS EVEN WORSEN IN THE FOLLOWING YEARS WELL I'D BE INTERESTED TO HEAR JAMES' ANSWER TO THE QUESTION BUT #1 I DO THINK OVERALL AND IN GENERAL AND AGAIN I DO NOT EXCEPT MYSELF FROM THIS CRITICISM THAT THE PRESS DOES NOT DO ENOUGH REPORTING ON NOT JUST THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT HAS BEEN RAISED BUT WHO GIVES IT AND WHAT LOGICALLY DO THEY EXPECT TO GET FOR IT THIS IS THE SECOND HALF OF THE QUESTION, THIS WILL BE THE MOST EXPENSIVE PRESIDENTIAL RACE IN OUR HISTORY I DON'T THINK THERE IS ANY QUESTION ABOUT THAT AND I DON'T SEE IT ENDING WE'RE TALKING NOW ABOUT THE INFLUENCE OF SPECIAL INTEREST MONEY IN CAMPAIGNS AS I UNDERSTAND THE QUESTION IS MONEY REALLY IMPORTANT TODAY IN AMERICAN POLITICS AND WILL IT BE EVEN MORE IMPORTANT IN THE FUTURE OF AMERICAN POLITICS AND THE ANSWER IS YES I MEAN I THINK I'M RIGHT ON THIS I THINK IT'S BOTH PARTIES THAT THE CANDIDATE WITH THE MOST MONEY IN THE BANK ON JANUARY 1ST OF ELECTION YEAR IS ALWAYS THE NOMINEE BUT YOUR RIGHT IT IS ENORMOUSLY IMPORTANT AND I DON'T SEE IT, WHEN YOU FRONT LOAD ALL OF THESE PRIMARIES YOU MAKE EARLY FUND RAISING EVEN MORE CRITICAL BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO HAVE THE MONEY TO BUY THE T.V. RIGHT AWAY THE THINGS THAT WE'VE DONE HAVE DONE NOTHING BUT MAKE MONEY EVEN MORE IMPORTANT IS THERE A HAND UP UNDER THE BALCONY AND IF SO I WILL HAVE TO DEPEND ON ONE OF THE MICROPHONE CARRIERS, WHILE WE'RE DOING THAT JAMES EARLIER YOU SAID THAT IT'S HILLARY CLINTON AND OBAMA, GORE IF HE WERE TO GET IN, I THINK YOU HAVEN'T MENTIONED THE NAME OF JOHN EDWARDS, PERHAPS ONE EARLIER ON IS THAT BECAUSE HE'S THE CANDIDATE YOU FEAR THE MOST? NO. IT'S NOT THAT I FEAR, JOHN EDWARDS IS NOT GOING TO BE A DEMOCRATIC NOMINEE THEY LIKE HIM, HE'S A GREAT GUY HE'S GOT THE MOST SPECIFIC HEALTHCARE PLAN, HE'S TALKING ABOUT ISSUES THAT MATTER HE'S NOT GOING TO BE THE NOMINEE WHY DO I COME HERE ON A SUNDAY NIGHT AND YOU COME OUT HERE AND YOU WANT ME TO SIT HERE AND TELL YOU SOMETHING THAT NO. BE HONEST. I'M JUST DEALING WITH THE HAND THAT'S DEALT WE'RE GOING TO A QUESTION IN THE BACK, I'LL HAVE TO I CAN'T SEE BACK THERE DO WE HAVE A MICROPHONE? I'M FOR THE PEOPLE UP ON THE BALCONY ALL RIGHT I'M A COMBAT DISABLED VIETNAM VET, WHO FAILED US IN THE 204 ELECTION THAT JOHN KERRY LOOKED LIKE THE DRAFT DODGER AND BUSH WAS THE HERO HOW DID THAT HAPPEN? (APPLAUSE) WELL THE PROBLEM IS THAT WHEN YOU LEAVE THINGS TO CHANCE AND THEY WERE MUCH MORE RUTHLESS, MUCH MORE DISCIPLINED THAT THE DEMOCRATS WERE IN 04 AND THE DEMOCRATS NEVER DEVELOPED A COHERENT NARRATIVE UPON WHICH TO BASE THE ELECTION YOU SAID THAT DEMOCRATS LACKED A CLEAR NARRATIVE IN THE LAST PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION, WHAT IS THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY NARRATIVE NOW? FIRST OF ALL IT'S DEVELOPING BUT CLEARLY YOU GOTTA REAL HARD CHANGE ELEMENT THAT IS PART OF THIS I THINK THAT THIS IS WHERE THE COUNTRY IS, WE'VE HAD LIKE THE SQUARE DEAL AND THE NEW DEAL AND THE NEW FRONTIER OR WHATEVER, I THINK THAT THE DEMOCRATIC NARRATIVE IS THIS IS THE REAL DEAL, IT'S TIME OF AMERICA TO RETURN TO REALITY (APPLAUSE) I THINK THAT'S WHERE THE COUNTRY IS AND I THINK THE COUNTRY IS IN YOU KNOW WE'RE STILL OVER A YEAR TO GO TO ELECTION DAY AND LET'S LET THIS THING FLUSH OUT BUT I THINK WHAT PEOPLE ARE LOOKING FOR IS REAL SOLUTIONS, THEY SEE THE REAL PROBLEMS OUT THERE, THEY DON'T SEE THAT WE HAVE TO SORT OF GET REAL ABOUT THEM AND I THINK THAT THAT'S GOING TO BE WHERE THE COUNTRY IS, I THINK THAT THE NARRATIVE IS IT'S TIME FOR AMERICA TO HAVE A REAL DEAL LADIES AND GENTLEMAN PLEASE JOIN ME, JAMES CARVILLE CAME A LONG WAY (APPLAUSE) THE ALWAYS SHAY AND WITHDRAWN JAMES CARVELLE WE'LL HAVE ANOTHER CONVERSATION LATER IN THE CAMPAIGN YEAR WITH A TOP REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST COMING UP NEXT BENAZIR BHUTTO'S TRAGIC RETURN TO PAKISTAN

WE BROUGHT YOU SEVERAL REPORTS ON THIS PROGRAM FROM PAKISTAN BECAUSE WE BELIEVE IT IS ONE OF IF NOT THE KEY COUNTRY IN THE GLOBAL WAR ON TERRORISM, BILLIONS OF YOUR TAX DOLLARS ARE GOING TO PAKISTAN IT'S A COUNTRY RULED BY A DICTATOR AND THE SITUATION THERE IS GROWING MORE UNSTABLE BY THE DAY FORMER PRIME MINISTER BENAZIR BHUTTO'S RETURN IS ONLY HIGHLIGHTING THE DIVIDE TWO PRODUCER/REPORTS FROM THIS BROADCAST VILLA MARX AND JENNY NORBERG WERE ON BHUTTO'S PLANE FOR HER RETURN TO CARACHE AND THE TRAGEDY THAT FOLLOWED THE BLAST NEAR HER MOTORCADE LATE LAST WEEK APPEAR TO BE THE WORK OF A SUICIDE BOMBER IN WHILE THE DEATH TOLL IS HIGH, MORE THAN 130 KILLED THE DAMAGE DONE TO THE FRAGILE POLITICAL SYSTEM DONE IN PAKISTAN MAY BE EQUALLY DEVASTATING BHUTTO HAS CALLED THE BOMBINGS AN ATTACK ON DEMOCRACY IN THE DAYS SINCE THE BLAST THE PEOPLE HAVE BEGUN CROWDING THE STREETS, THIS TIME FOR FUNERALS FOR THOSE KILLED PAKISTAN'S DICTATOR AND PRESIDENT PERVEZ MUSHARRAF CONDEMNED THE BODIES BUT HE ALSO HAS A LOT TO LOSE WITH BHUTTO'S RETURN PARLIAMENTARY ELECTIONS SCHEDULED FOR JANUARY COULD RETURN BHUTTO FOR THIRD TERM AS PRIME MINISTER

BHUTTO HERSELF JOINED IN THE MORNING INVITING THE WIDOWS OF DEAD TO HER HOME WHERE SHE LEAD THEM IN PRAYER AND FOR THE FIRST TIME SINCE THE ATTACK BHUTTO SPOKE TO A SMALL GROUP OF JOURNALISTS OURS, HDNET'S WAS THE ONLY VIDEO CAMERA SHE ALLOWED INSIDE HER HOME SHE VOWED TO CONTINUE HER CAMPAIGN DESPITE THE TRAGEDY AND DANGEROUS POLITICAL ENVIRONMENT I HAVE TO MODIFY MY PLAN ACCORDINGLY BUT I WONT GIVE UP CONTACTING THE PEOPLE THERE IS A GREAT APPRECIATION THAT I HAVE TO MODIFY IT BUT AGAIN AS I SAID PEOPLE DIDN'T DIE BECAUSE THEY CAME OUT TO SEE ME PEOPLE DIED BECAUSE THE LIGHTS WERE PUT OFF ON OUR SECURITY COULD NOT SEE THE SUICIDE BOMBER OR THE CAR THAT WAS COMING THERE AS I SAID THERE IS NO 100% GUARANTEE THAT WHEN YOU GO OUT THAT YOU WONT BE HIT BY A SNIPER OR A BULLET ESPECIALLY (INDISCERNIBLE) THERE IS NO GUARANTEE CRITICS OF BHUTTO QUESTION HER COMMITMENT TO CHANGING THAT CULTURE OF VIOLENCE IT'S A TOPIC I HAD A CHANCE TO DISCUSS WITH HER IN AUGUST WHEN WE SAT DOWN TO TALK ABOUT HER THEN RUMORED RETURN TO PAKISTAN

I CAN PROUDLY SAY THAT WHEN I WAS PRIME MINISTER OF PAKISTAN THE TERRORIST WERE ON THE RUN AND THEY WERE ON THE RUN BECAUSE I RELIED ON THE PEOPLE OF PAKISTAN, THE PEOPLE OF MY COUNTRY ARE MY STRENGTH THEY ARE THE POPULAR BASE, THEY HAVE A STAKE IN PAKISTAN AND THEY COME FORWARD TO DEFEND THEIR OWN COMMUNITIES AND TO DEFEND OUR SOCIETY SO I WOULD CHALLENGE MY CRITICS AND SAY COMPARE YOUR RECORD WITH MY RECORD IN GOVERNMENT I SUSPECT THAT SOMEONE'S GONNA ASK ME WHEN THIS INTERVIEW IS OVER A VERSION OF, WELL DAN YOU TALKED TO THE LADY? IS SHE TOUGH ENOUGH? ARE YOU? WELL-- I THINK THAT I AM TOUGH ON THE CAUSES OF CRIME. BUT I DON'T SEE MYSELF AS BEING A HEARTLESS PERSON. I SEE MYSELF AS SOMEBODY WHO CAN TAKE ACTION WHEN ACTION IS NECESSARY. BUT WHO DOESN'T RELY ON FORCE ALONE. WHO PUTS BACK TOGETHER A PACKAGE THAT CAN INVOLVE OTHER PEOPLE. I DON'T SEE MYSELF AS A MESSIAH WHO SINGLE-HANDEDLY CAN GO AND DEFEAT ALL THE DEMONS. I SEE MYSELF AS A LEADER WHO CAN PUT TOGETHER A TEAM, WHO CAN PUT TOGETHER THE PEOPLE. AND BY INVOLVING THE PEOPLE AND MAKING THEM STAKEHOLDERS, CAN CARRY THEM FORWARD IN A PARTICULAR DIRECTION THAT CAN LEAD TO PEACE.

THE ATTACK WAS A CLOSE CALL FOR BHUTTO AND A STRONG STATEMENT THAT NOT EVERYONE NOT NEARLY EVERYONE IN PAKISTAN IS HAPPY TO HAVE HER BACK IN OUR AUGUST CONVERSATION SHE SAID HER SECURITY AND THAT OF THE COUNTRY WERE IN THE HANDS OF THE CURRENT REGIME IS IT A REAL PROSPECT OF PRESIDENT MUSHARRAF DISMISSING THE CHARGES, GRANTING YOU, IF YOU WILL, A GUARANTEE AS MUCH AS ANYONE CAN GIVE IT, OF YOUR PERSONAL SAFETY AND HAVE YOU COME BACK TO PAKISTAN? WELL-- CERTAINLY DISCUSSIONS TOWARDS THIS END HAVE BEEN HELD BETWEEN GENERAL MUSHARRAF'S SIDE AND THE PAKISTAN PEOPLE'S PARTY. WE'RE TALKING ABOUT INTERNAL RECONCILIATION AND PUTTING AN END TO THE POLARIZATION AND THE USE OF JUDICIAL PERSECUTION AGAINST INCONVENIENT POLITICAL PERSONALITIES AND I THINK THAT AS WE ARE APPROACHING THE AUTUMN GENERAL MUSHARRAF AND HIS COLLEAGUES ARE GOING TO HAVE TO MAKE UP THEIR MINDS WHETHER THEY WISH TO HAVE A FACILITATED TRANSFER TO DEMOCRACY OR WHETHER THEY WANT TO CONTINUE TO EXCLUDE MAJOR POLITICAL PARTIES LIKE MINE FROM THE POLITICAL PROCESS IN AN EVEN-HANDED FASHION FORMER PRIME MINISTER BENAZIR BHUTTO NOW BACK IN PAKISTAN, WE'LL HAVE MORE FROM PAKISTAN IN THE COMING WEEKS FINALLY TONIGHT A FEW WORDS ABOUT THE FREE FLOW OF INFORMATION ACT THAT LAST WEEK PASSED THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES WITH OVERWHELMING BIPARTISAN SUPPORT AND IS NOW BEING CONSIDERED IN THE U.S. SENATE IN THE FACE OF PRESIDENT BUSH'S VETO THREAT THE MOST IMPORTANT THING TO KNOW THOUGH THIS IS OFTEN CALLED A JOURNALIST SHIELD LAW OR A LAW THAT WOULD PROTECT JOURNALISTS FROM REVEALING CONFIDENTIAL SOURCES WHAT IT ACTUALLY SEEKS TO PROTECT IS THE PUBLIC'S RIGHT TO KNOW WHAT IS GOING ON, WHAT IS REALLY GOING ON IN THE CORRIDORS OF POWER A LIFETIME IN JOURNALISM HAS TAUGHT ME THAT IF GOVERNMENT AND CORPORATE WHISTLE BLOWERS CAN'T BE ASSURED OF CONFIDENTIALITY UNDER SOME CIRCUMSTANCES THEY ARE FAR LESS LIKELY TO COME FORWARD AND WE THE PEOPLE ARE FAR LESS LIKELY TO HEAR OF SERIOUS WRONG DOINGS OR RECOGNIZE PROPAGANDA SOMETHING FOR YOU TO CONSIDER AS THE SENATE DELIBERATES IS THE QUESTION OF JUST WHO IS A JOURNALIST? ARE JOURNALIST ONLY THOSE AS THE HOUSE BILL DEFINES THEM WHO MAKE THEIR LIVINGS OFF OF JOURNALISM OR IS A JOURNALIST ANYONE WHO PRACTICES OR CLAIMS TO PRACTICE JOURNALISM SUCH AS INTERNET OR OTHER CITIZEN JOURNALISTS AND THINK ABOUT THIS, YOU MAY ALSO WANT TO CONSIDER ONE OF THIS JOURNALISTS FAVORITE DEFINITIONS OF WHAT IS NEWS THAT IS NEWS IS SOMETHING THE PUBLIC NEEDS OT KNOW THAT SOMEBODY, SOMEWHERE IN POWER WANTS TO KEEP SECRET ALL THE REST IS JUST ADVERTISING FOR HDNET DAN RATHER REPORTING GOOD NIGHT